Bad Democratic Underground
Created 04/20/2014

The "History of Feminism Group" are
Democratic Underground's
Administrator approved Trolls

Democratic Underground's Administrator approved Trolls are members of DU's so-called Safe Haven Group, History of Feminism (HoF) and their supporters. The History of Feminism Group are also known as "The Swarm", or sometimes just as "The Usual Suspects", as they sow discord on DU by posting misandrist OP's (Opening Posts), flame bait arguments designed for upsetting people, by posting inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages, always denigrating men, just because they are male, with the deliberate intent of provoking members into an emotional responses or for disrupting, derailing, normal on-topic discussions. In other words, a hate Group, that harasses, bullies, trolls, their targets victims. Their targets are men in general and anyone that objects to their bullying.

Men and women are not supposed to be adversaries. Most of us get along just fine with others, regardless of gender. Why? Because most people treat others with reasonable respect and even as good friends. We are social creatures, after all.
There is no reason, good or otherwise, why some of us feel the need to treat most of the other gender in an adversarial manner, as a matter of course. When people paint the other gender in broad brush strokes, as if they are mostly or even all the same, the brush welder has some serous emotional issues to contend with.

This web page is about a group on Democratic Underground that does treats most of the male gender as the enemy. And the administrators there have allowed this group to get away with it for years. If any DU member or Group were to treat gays, lesbians, transgender, women, people of color, the intellectually or developmental disabled and physically disabled, nationality, ethnic, and/or even Southerners in this manner, they would have been gone a long time ago. But for some reason the DU Admin has allowed men in general to be an exception, to be bullied and trolled by the History of Feminism Group. And the worst part is, they, the leaders of the HoF, get off on it.

The members of HoF have some obvious, serous underlying psychological and emotional issues that need to be properly dealt with. Being the most contentious Group, outside of the Gun Control & RKBA (Group) on DU, you'd think the Admin would realize something is very wrong there.

And in the Democratic Underground tradition, I use links to back many of my assertions and opinions. Truth does have a Liberal bias.
Survey: Online trolls are 'everyday sadists'

Subjects such as "Rape Culture", going back to examples of WWII Comfort woman as proof of current misogyny in our culture now. Or some over the top event in India, as if these things are happening now in the USA and are the fault of the "privileged" white males in this country, because of... well, you know, our superior white privilege, like, you know, 'cause we're white men, so therefore we're "holding everyone else down".
Yeah, but, but, but... History of Feminism deals with the way women have been treated and mistreated in history.
OK, fair enough, but it is in the way they presented it, as proof men in general now are the problem. The denigrating, slams, slimming, insulting, the trolling and otherwise treating men in general with undeserved disrespect for something they had, or have no control over. Or all too often, it's just the unhealthy, reality twisting perception by the HoF that something is thus and so, when for most people, it is nothing of the sort.

Using their definition of "White Privilege", current male, DU members are somehow responsible, even for women not getting the vote until 1923. These trolls say they want the same privileges as the white males. Instead of working for real equality, as actual, real Feminist do, by working with others, to build up, the HoF instead, tear down. In other words, to get the equality they say they want, they are trying to tear down others to their level. They also think they deserve more equality than the men they so desperately despise. That never works out well in real life.

This is the same Group that thinks Andrea Dworkin is someone to look up to, to defend. The thread at the link is kind of a long read, but certain members start to stand out trying, to defend Andrea's psychotic misandry, without actually coming out and saying such. I remember a debate between Andrea Dworkin, and a porn actress.
To me it sounds like the trolls are trying to defend Andrea Dworkin, without appearing to be defending her. They sure are not criticizing her much. The defenders focused mostly on ONE phrase, she may or may not have said in so many words. But is is pretty clear she did lean that way. "All sex is rape".

If the HoF would stay mostly in their Safe Haven, it wouldn't be so bad. But, being the nasty, sadistic trolls they are, they post their flame bait OP's in their safe haven and even in General Discussion, then REC'd (Recommend) the hell out of it, to get the thread to show up on the Home page, where everyone can see their latests sexist, misandrist dreck. Lots of responses and REC'D to their OP's, prove to them, they're correct in their beliefs. Never mind that sometimes they have to swarm and REC'd their own General Discussion threads, to make it look like someone cares, because no one else will touch it, when they bring their "Save Haven" out into public area. Puke

Oh, and don't forget the male "White Privilege", they rail against, as if women of any color, doesn't have any privileges over anyone else in this country. There are many homeless, jobless, white males, with no place to go, that can dispute the claim of 'white privilege'
The HoF members always seem to play the innocent, oppressed victims, even as they victimize others. In fact they have been known to use their own "victimization" as the excuse to victimize others.
Another characteristic of the HoF, besides co-opting the word "feminist" to mean what they want it to mean, like the Republicans did "Liberal", is that they accuse others of what they themselves are guilty of, the purpose of which, is to muddy the waters, as did the bu$h era Republicans, when they maligned Democrats who were exposing the Republicans malfeasant. I see the leaders of the HoF doing the. exact. same. thing! Only using their definition of "feminism" in place of party affiliation.
. You don't even have to read too carefully to start to see how they operate.

They fixate on rapes of all kinds, barely differencing between violent rapes and statutory rape, even when it is between a 16 or 17 year old female and her boy friend, who just turned 18.

Men are seldom shown in a favorable light by the HoF.
See for yourself.

If anyone on DU would treat any other group of people, other than White Males, with such disrespect, as do the HoF, they would be gone in short order. Be they gays, lesbians, transgender, women, people of color, the intellectually and developmental disabled and physically disabled, nationality, ethnic, Southerners. None are allowed to be put down individually or as a group.
But your run of the mill white males are somehow excepted by the Admin and allowed to be fair game to the HoF, to be insulted, slimed and otherwise denigrated on Democratic Underground, both in and out of the HoF's "Safe Haven". Why do the three Administrators on DU allow this? How is this not a violation of the web site's own stated rules, the Terms of Service.

Here are some Examples of the HoF's male love:

Not All Men: A Brief History of Every Dude’s Favorite Argument
"The "not all men" defense against feminist arguments is infuriating and unhelpful, but it also represents a weird kind of progress"
The implication being that it IS ALL men. But anyone with a grip on reality knows that that can't be the case, because not all men are the same, just as not all women are the same. This is another attempt by the HoF, boston bean, in this case, using that broad brush of theirs, to paint "all men" as somehow being misogynistic.

It just keeps getting better and better...
Rape culture, patriarchy, pornography, and socialized acquiescence

Understanding the Perpetrators of Sexual Violence (University of Michigan)

When men call themselves "sex-positive feminists"

If the democratic party starts to represent MRA ideology

BainsBane pointed out how many women said "Sorry" when rejecting the dude in that video (HOF THREAD)

Why do we need to keep talking about rape culture?

Rape Culture 101

#rapecultureiswhen Is the Perfect Answer to Everyone Who Denies Rape Culture Exists

Just some stuff (pic heavy - HOF THREAD)

As seen on tumblr. A funny for my HoF friends. :)

This one is a must read!
A Glossary of MRAs feel free to add

Here is another example of their mind set, where they had to go back to 1958 Europe. The men are French, yet the implication is that this is somehow normal now and women gets harassed in modern day public, right here in the good old 'ol US of A, just because they are women in public. There is no context for the picture at the link provided, other than the year, 1958 and the general locale of being in Europe.
This historical picture creeps me right the fuck out

Their trolling consist of purposely misconstruing what was posted in whatever post they are responding to, putting words into the targets mouth, that were never said, never meant, nor even implied. And then attacking the poster for saying these words that they, the HoF themselves supplied, that were never actually said by their target, usually accompanied by their swarming the thread. In other words outright lying about the intent and meaning of their target's posts, as trolls, bullies (and sadists) do, to get posts "hidden" and/or even to get their targeted DU'er banned!

They are known to do mass alerts in threads, on post made by their current target, to be judged by a DU jury system and even to separately bombard the DU Admin, with their outrageous, often reality twisting comments as the reason for the Alert. Their joyous posts of approval in HoF later, on posts they cause to be hidden or occasionally of poster being banned. The celebration fits the definition of troll and sadism, to a T. The worst of these, the leaders, BainesBain, seabeyond redqueen and boston bean. boston bean usually works in the background, directing things. Lately though she(?) has been more visible.

Here is a simple example of how the HoF twist and confuse and derail things, to show their victim in a poor light.

Response to Old and In the Way (Reply #7)
Sat Mar 1, 2014, 12:20 AM
Star Member pnwmom (52,362 posts)
21. Are 50% of DU men in the men's rights group? Uh, no. n/t

Now below, this is the post that HoF member, pnmom is responding to. Where is the mention of the "men's right group" in this post? This is standard operating procedure for them, to derail the thread and confuse people.

Response to Starry Messenger (Reply #6)
Fri Feb 28, 2014, 10:40 PM
Star Member Old and In the Way (36,871 posts)
7. Easy answer.
"Again, there was no mention of DU males in the article. " So, this could have been written by DU females?
At least 50% of DU are, wouldn't it be expected to note that this is, in no way, a condemnation of 1/2 of the board? It would be nice if the poster, who posts an anonymous "male" on another website, at least gives the courtesy to this board's males by not lumping us in with an obvious that too much to ask?

I didn't see mention of the men's group in that post either. Now imagine a swarm with emotional triggers, doing this against their target. It can get mean and nasty real quick, with their target wondering what is going on here, because he had said nothing of the sort to cause the attacks.

How the Leaders of the HoF control their Subjects:
As I mentioned elsewhere here, The HoF leaders do not advocate counselling and in fact down play it. Why? Because the leaders use the PDST caused by rape, abusive relationships/marriages and dysfunctional upbringing, of the other HoF members, for control, for when they want to swarm a DU member that stands up to their BS. They use known triggers against their target and then let the swarm loose on them. In other words many of the HoF members are being used as tools by the HoF leadership. There should be a special place inside the Ninth Circle (Treachery) in Hell for the likes of BainsBains, seabeyond and boston bean and their supporting cohorts, for preying on and using hurting HoF members, suffering from various levels of PDST, for their own ends. Why don't they advocate counselling for those that need it, in the History of Feminism Group? The leaders never do. That would take away their main tool for control of their "Swarm".
And one more thing, The forbidden words the Hof do not want the rest of DU to use? Most are trigger words for them. Think about that the next time you see them get up tight over the use of whatever word.
Here's a post by BainesBain. That thread on men was fun while it lasted"
"It had the potential for so many good digs. I'm almost sorry to see it gone."
The post under that, gives a link to the thread in question. BainesBain is an example of a person that gets sadistic pleasure from tormenting others.

While trolling is generally forbidden on DU, by the site's SOP, the Admin have mostly turned a blind eye and allowed the trolling by the HoF, to harass other DU'ers for years, with the HoF doing their part, by driving the more thoughtful, Left leaning DU members away and in the process, moving DU ever more to the Right, with the Right-of-Center leaning DLC and 3rd Way types and corporatists supporters gaining prominence, at the expense of long time Liberals and Progressives. In a few more years, the name, 'Democratic Underground' will become a misnomer, as if it isn't becoming one already, as most of the remaining members will be Right of Center politicly, aka, the business and Wall Street friendly, DLC, 3rd Way, New Democrats, i.e., The Republicans of old.

It used to be, DU would have important news articles and information, often, two or three days before it appeared on the main stream news. That is not happening so much in the last few years. More often than not, the news now appears on Yahoo, Facebook, CNN and in the local 6:00 and 10:00 news first, then on DU the next day. The opposite of what used to be. This is partially the fault of the HoF and their "agree with us, or we alert", mind set, driving the better, more knowledgeable members away in frustration. Oh, how Democratic Underground has fallen.

Why are the members of the HoF behaving as they do? The trolling, the arrogance, the bullying, the anger, the sadistic pleasure they derive, with the harassment and trouble they cause other DU members. Other than possibly the sadists, most of the HoF members have some degree of PDST, from mild to severe. The causes stem from being in abusive relationships, marriages and/or dysfunctional upbringings and from being raped themselves and not doing much, if anything, to deal with any resultant emotional damage.
Those brought up in dysfunctional families often have no idea what normal is, or what a healthy relationship is like. Some even think being raped is something normal men do to women, because they can. A few others are just plain and simply psychotic, and even sadistic. They enjoy causing emotional pain in others. They get off on it.
(See the Resource links below)

The HoF leaders down play and attach a stigma to getting counselling, with having mental problems, insanity, etc. To them, it is the rest of the world that has the problems, the rest of the world that needs help. They think they are fine, when the reality is, they are anything but fine.

Why the anger? Why the need for swarming to reinforce each other. No other DU Group and their supporters, Safe Haven or not, disrupts, bullies, stalks, hold grudges, is fixated on the abnormal as somehow being the normal. Rape, white privilege, men looking at women in public, just men in general, that they rail against.

Or has as many fellow DU members locked out of their HoF "Safe Haven". Around 50 or so. The rest of the safe havens on DU, only have a few, if any. The HoF does not like to have its own safe haven sanctity violated, but has no problem of violating the sanctity of other safe havens. The HoF also have been known to try to impose their safe haven rules on the General Discussion Forum. A forum that is open to everyone. And they also viciously denigrates the Men's Group. Over all, a more mature, mentally healthier Group, by far, than the HoF.
For comparison, the History of Feminism. See the difference? How can one not?

At one time the HoF members were the power behind DU's Word Police. There was a secret, long list of words that were "forbidden" to be used on DU. Nobody in the self-appointed Word Police would produce the complete, ever growing, ever shifting list. You found out that you had violated their forbidden word list when you received a reply (Or jury results) saying something along the lines of "We do not use that word here." As if they actually had any authority over other DU'ers. It was getting really ridicules before it finely died the death it so richly deserved. Even common everyday words were suspect because they contained a "banned" word within them. For instance, "retarded", even within posted news stories having nothing to do with any disability. Another example would be words like 'history', being sexist because it had the words 'his' and 'story' within it. "His Story" Nothing gender neutral about that! Oh yeah, it was really that silly sometimes.
Anyway, many members of what is now the HoF, were eyeball..., oops, I mean eyebrow deep, in the attempted censorship by the bullying and harassment they did by being the self-appointed word police.
Come down to Florida? I'm from Florida.
"I grew up in Florida. I'm in Florida a lot. But I don't laugh my ass off at black or gay jokes. Or fat jokes. But sometimes a joke is a just a joke, not an indictment on one's overall character.
I'd better stop. This is what got me banned from the feminist group...I'm not allowed to speak freely. I must stay within the constraints of the accusers of my horrible character."

Internet Trolls Really Are Horrible People
Internet Trolls Really Are Horrible People
Narcissistic, Machiavellian, psychopathic, and sadistic.
By Chris Mooney
In the past few years, the science of Internet trollology has made some strides. Last year, for instance, we learned that by hurling insults and inciting discord in online comment sections, so-called Internet trolls (who are frequently anonymous) have a polarizing effect on audiences, leading to politicization, rather than deeper understanding of scientific topics.

That's bad, but it's nothing compared with what a new psychology paper has to say about the personalities of trolls themselves. The research, conducted by Erin Buckels of the University of Manitoba and two colleagues, sought to directly investigate whether people who engage in trolling are characterized by personality traits that fall in the so-called Dark Tetrad: Machiavellianism (willingness to manipulate and deceive others), narcissism (egotism and self-obsession), psychopathy (the lack of remorse and empathy), and sadism (pleasure in the suffering of others).

It is hard to overplay the results: The study found correlations, sometimes quite significant, between these traits and trolling behavior. What's more, it also found a relationship between all Dark Tetrad traits (except for narcissism) and the overall time that an individual spent, per day, commenting on the Internet.


Internet Trolls Really Are Horrible People

Internet trolls are also real-life trolls

Internet trolls are also real-life trolls

Why do some people find so much pleasure in harassing others online? A new study attempts to shed light on the behaviour of internet trolls


A 'troll', in internet slang, is someone who deliberately upsets others by starting arguments or posting unnecessarily inflammatory messages on blogs, chatrooms, or forums. In recent years, it's gotten so bad that YouTube needed to develop a way for users to moderate their video's comments section, and Popular Science shut down its comments section entirely. Indeed, for trolls, the anonymity of the internet is the perfect playground.


Trolling enjoyment was very strongly associated with a sadistic personality, and was also correlated with Machiavellianism and psychopathy. In fact, further statistical analysis revealed that most of the Dark Tetrad correlations with internet trolling were because of overlap with sadism.


Actually, the study may have some interesting implications. Since a sadistic person is characterised by being vicious and degrading toward others (sometimes physically), it's possible that the internet allows them to redirect their energy. If they're inflicting harm through anonymous words, perhaps it's preventing them from doing something much more destructive in person. On the extreme end, and unsurprisingly, sadism is commonly seen in sexual offenders and serial killers.
Internet trolls are also real-life trolls

Survey: Online trolls are 'everyday sadists'

Survey: Online trolls are 'everyday sadists'

Doug Gross, CNN

By Doug Gross, CNN
updated 11:19 AM EST, Tue February 11, 2014

(CNN) -- If you've ever complained that the trolls junking up online comment sections are a bunch of sadistic psychopaths, you might be onto something.

An online survey by a group of Canadian researchers suggests that Internet trolls are more likely than others to show signs of sadism, psychopathy and "Machiavellianism": a disregard for morality and tendency to manipulate or exploit others.

"It was sadism, however, that had the most robust associations with trolling of any of the personality measures," says an article by psychologists from the University of Manitoba, University of Winnipeg and University of British Columbia. "In fact, the associations between sadism and ... scores were so strong that it might be said that online trolls are prototypical everyday sadists."

Sadism is a tendency to take pleasure in other people's pain or discomfort.

Survey: Online trolls are 'everyday sadists'

PTSD After Divorce
According to The National Institute of Mental Health, PTSD includes flashbacks, bad dreams, staying away from triggers, feeling emotionally numb, feeling guilty, having trouble with memory, being easily startled, feeling tense and angry. Additionally, the diagnosis of PTSD requires that the symptoms persist beyond 30 days and that they interfere with daily life. There is a difference between normal grief, shock and anxiety and the pathology of PTSD.


There is help for those who are experiencing PTSD-like symptoms after a divorce. First, communicate your symptoms to your doctor or therapist. A checklist can be a useful tool, especially if you are having trouble putting words to your feelings. Be firm. I found that some therapists and doctors didn't really listen to me, rather they projected how they thought I should be feeling. Different therapies, including EMDR, have been shown to be effective against PTSD. There are medications that can be useful to limit the anxiety and to calm the mind and body. Additionally, mindfulness practices, including yoga and meditation, can also help to reset the sympathetic nervous system and regulate the release of stress hormones.

And then there is this web page: Profile of the Sociopath
How many behavioural characteristics of the high profile leaders of the HoF did you see there?
Could this be the reason why the HoF have been gunning for me for two years? Because I posted that link on DU several times?

You will have to admit, that after reading the posts in HoF, there is something very wrong with the denizens of Democratic Underground's, History of Feminism Group. The anger, the constant man sliming, the fixation on rapes, the 'if you don't agree with us, you are part of our problem'. The tearing down, instead of working to fix the problems they are constantly complaining about. Demonizing the very people, both men and women, that they need to work with, if they were really genuine and wanted the equality they say they want.
But being experienced Trolls, instead of being feminist, of being sadistic, instead of being empathetic, of being arrogant bullies, instead of being nice people, what can you expect from this group?

Why are the DU Administrators allowing these trolls, these psychopaths, these sadistic, arrogant bullies, to disrupt and otherwise give the once great, Democrat Underground a bad reputation? What do the HoF Trolls have on the three Administrators of Democratic Underground, so they allow the HoF to so freely disrupt their web site, for so long, without much consequence to themselves?

I now have no real way to defend myself on DU. As I said above, the DU Administration turns a blind eye to the HoF's trollish, destructive behavior. I'm not even sure the DU Administrators even read my E-mails trying to defend myself. They, the DU Administrators, took what the HoF said I said, over what I actually did say. This web site is all I have for rebuttal.
Fabricating False Claims and using those to attack other DU members is something the Admin should take seriously. Apparently the Admin thinks it is alright for the HoF to do this. Why do the DU Admin turn a blind eye toward the abusive trolling the HoF engage in?

And after I was banned, someone posted that I was "mocking a rape victim". I would never do such a thing - ever. And their jubilation at their accomplishment and still the Admin does nothing. Apparently the HoF have been trying ban me for two years, for something I had posted two years ago. Even the number of times I have served on a jury is of concern for them.
I had not had any posts hidden, despite their best efforts. Right now it still hurts too much to read the false, hurtful sliming they did to me to get me banned after 13 years on DU. To link to their lies in the thread that got me that got me banned. I am in no way like how they made me out to be.
boston bean's History of Feminism, celebration thread: hallefrickenluya!

"So much sensitivity when their ox is being gored...
and none whatsoever to anyone outside their clique."

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